My main concern is as follow:
I have noted some irregular behaviour of trigger in shooting and not linear adjustment in trgger weight (is difficult to get 500 grms.)
I have noted some displacement of "Swivel Rocker" (part Nº 2774968 in exploded diagram) from betwen 0,5 to 1 mm. This part has no adjustment, but i think that this movement is responsable for the erratic behaviour of the trigger.
I have sent an e-mail to Walther but the answer was not satisfactory to me (came in German and is a part of Adjustment from the manual), no mention if the part Nº 20 must be move or no.
I would be very appreciated if someone have same concern and the solutions if is needed.
My apologize for my por English, and thank you for your attendance
Trigger of Walther LP400
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rcamiruagaj
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2007 7:43 pm
Trigger of Walther LP400
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Ulrich Eichstädt
- Posts: 187
- Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 11:06 am
- Location: Dortmund
May I suggest another solution (I'm head of press & communication for the Walther-group and pistol shooter myself).
At first I must apologize, that you received an answer from the company in german (assuming, that you didn't write yourself in german...).
I've talked some minutes ago to Thomas Bretschneider, head of the design team of (among others) the LP400.
Here is a link to a more explicit exploded view, also with translations german/english of the parts:
http://www.carl-walther.de/public/downl ... _LP400.pdf
I would recommend in general for every foreign customer with questions to check at first the english(!) part of www.carl-walther.de - in the (somehow irritating) PRESS menu you will find manuals and also exploded views of all actual and a lot of older WALTHER guns:
http://www.carl-walther.de/cw.php?lang=en&content=press
These described variations of the trigger weight were often mentioned by LP300-owners, with the LP400's new trigger design it should be better - in most cases...
Tom Bretschneider by the way doesn't believe, that a slighly moving swivel rocker (0,5-1 mm measured at which point??) influences the continuity of the trigger weight. But you never know...
Two possible explanations for that complaint:
1. The second stage trigger weight may be too low in comparison to the first stage trigger weight. Your problem could vanish, if you (slightly) increase the second stage weight. That's the easiest way for repairs "in the jungle", without a certified Walther dealer to get help from. If you don't want to alter the relationship betwen first and second stage trigger weight (I can imagine some reasons), we have to use a bigger caliber...
2. (more complicated). If you can e-mail your address to me: press@carl-walther.de , we would send you a new spring, that has been introduced to newer LP400 models since last month. For all the other obviously curious readers the way to go on:
To allow a lower second stage trigger weight the spring no. 148 (part no. 2744298) has to be replaced with the new spring no. 2802261 (not mentioned in the diagram). Additionally the Slide catch lever spring No. 191 has to be.... (drums....)
removed completely, it's not needed anymore (if the spring was replaced!)
We would recommend this operation to be done by a certified Walther service man (or woman), but perhaps we can try it "remote", if you send us your address to send you the new spring (of course for free!)
Caution:
This is no general recommendation to exchange the spring - it is only worth thinking about if you like to have a second stage trigger weight around 100 of the 500 grams or even lower.
I have been pistol coach here in germany since decades and would not do that without serious reasons - the risk of "overpulling" the second stage weight and losing the shot is very high, because of course in compensation the first stage travel weight has to be increased to go to 500 grams or a litlle bit higher (my recommended trigger weight is 520 grams - safe enough to hold the weight in the gun control, not to heavy to pull precise and smooth)
And at least
3. If all these descriptions don't work, the reason for the variations of the trigger weight will maybe caused by something completely different. Please contact your national Walther service instead of DIY...
At first I must apologize, that you received an answer from the company in german (assuming, that you didn't write yourself in german...).
I've talked some minutes ago to Thomas Bretschneider, head of the design team of (among others) the LP400.
Here is a link to a more explicit exploded view, also with translations german/english of the parts:
http://www.carl-walther.de/public/downl ... _LP400.pdf
I would recommend in general for every foreign customer with questions to check at first the english(!) part of www.carl-walther.de - in the (somehow irritating) PRESS menu you will find manuals and also exploded views of all actual and a lot of older WALTHER guns:
http://www.carl-walther.de/cw.php?lang=en&content=press
These described variations of the trigger weight were often mentioned by LP300-owners, with the LP400's new trigger design it should be better - in most cases...
Tom Bretschneider by the way doesn't believe, that a slighly moving swivel rocker (0,5-1 mm measured at which point??) influences the continuity of the trigger weight. But you never know...
Two possible explanations for that complaint:
1. The second stage trigger weight may be too low in comparison to the first stage trigger weight. Your problem could vanish, if you (slightly) increase the second stage weight. That's the easiest way for repairs "in the jungle", without a certified Walther dealer to get help from. If you don't want to alter the relationship betwen first and second stage trigger weight (I can imagine some reasons), we have to use a bigger caliber...
2. (more complicated). If you can e-mail your address to me: press@carl-walther.de , we would send you a new spring, that has been introduced to newer LP400 models since last month. For all the other obviously curious readers the way to go on:
To allow a lower second stage trigger weight the spring no. 148 (part no. 2744298) has to be replaced with the new spring no. 2802261 (not mentioned in the diagram). Additionally the Slide catch lever spring No. 191 has to be.... (drums....)
removed completely, it's not needed anymore (if the spring was replaced!)
We would recommend this operation to be done by a certified Walther service man (or woman), but perhaps we can try it "remote", if you send us your address to send you the new spring (of course for free!)
Caution:
This is no general recommendation to exchange the spring - it is only worth thinking about if you like to have a second stage trigger weight around 100 of the 500 grams or even lower.
I have been pistol coach here in germany since decades and would not do that without serious reasons - the risk of "overpulling" the second stage weight and losing the shot is very high, because of course in compensation the first stage travel weight has to be increased to go to 500 grams or a litlle bit higher (my recommended trigger weight is 520 grams - safe enough to hold the weight in the gun control, not to heavy to pull precise and smooth)
And at least
3. If all these descriptions don't work, the reason for the variations of the trigger weight will maybe caused by something completely different. Please contact your national Walther service instead of DIY...
great post!
What a thorough and helpful response from a manufacturer representative! Bravo!
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rcamiruagaj
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2007 7:43 pm
Re: great post!
Sure it is remarkable and of course I just thank you to Ulrich and your team of Walther.FredB wrote:What a thorough and helpful response from a manufacturer representative! Bravo!
muy bien hecho!!!!
Walther LP400 trigger
Dear Ulrich,
Is this offer, the new spring and instructions, extensive to another happy owner of a LP400?
Thanks in advance.
Aramis
Is this offer, the new spring and instructions, extensive to another happy owner of a LP400?
Thanks in advance.
Aramis
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Ulrich Eichstädt
- Posts: 187
- Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 11:06 am
- Location: Dortmund
No. Happy LP400 owners don't have problems with their trigger as the threadstarter described...
Seriously: The difference should only be recognized under certain conditions, as I have described above. To alter LP400's even without problems occuring, let's say across-the-board and all over the world via remote explanations and envelopes with 5 mm long springs wasn't the intention and would surely bring this help to a very quick end (and me have a reporting to the boss...).
The change in design is really minimal, but as in every product also done in a constant floating process over the years. To actualize every earlier sold LP400 for free is not possible. Those lucky owners who get the chance to meet the Walther service team people somewhere at international competitions can come there and ask then for a change, and it will be, if no other spare parts have to be changed, done for free as part of our service.
(oh god, what have I done..., facepalm)
Seriously: The difference should only be recognized under certain conditions, as I have described above. To alter LP400's even without problems occuring, let's say across-the-board and all over the world via remote explanations and envelopes with 5 mm long springs wasn't the intention and would surely bring this help to a very quick end (and me have a reporting to the boss...).
The change in design is really minimal, but as in every product also done in a constant floating process over the years. To actualize every earlier sold LP400 for free is not possible. Those lucky owners who get the chance to meet the Walther service team people somewhere at international competitions can come there and ask then for a change, and it will be, if no other spare parts have to be changed, done for free as part of our service.
(oh god, what have I done..., facepalm)
Walther LP400 trigger
OK.
See you in Munich next year.
Att.
Aramis
See you in Munich next year.
Att.
Aramis
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Ulrich Eichstädt
- Posts: 187
- Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 11:06 am
- Location: Dortmund
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deadeyedick
- Posts: 1184
- Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2008 5:55 pm
- Location: Australia
Put a small drop of lube on the sear notch. I had a similar problem with mine. The trigger weight went up to over 700 grams within the first 2000-3000 rounds and I couldn't adjust it below 600 grams. It has over 10000 rounds on it now and it's still holding at the 525 grams I set it at after lubing it.
Hi Ulrich,
I have just received the new spring 2802261 and removed the other springs. Excellent feel to the trigger now, and adjustability greatly improved. My only question is that Screw C sticks out approximately 1.5mm from the frame - is this intended? I didn't measure the spring length before I swapped them out.
I have just received the new spring 2802261 and removed the other springs. Excellent feel to the trigger now, and adjustability greatly improved. My only question is that Screw C sticks out approximately 1.5mm from the frame - is this intended? I didn't measure the spring length before I swapped them out.
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Ulrich Eichstädt
- Posts: 187
- Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 11:06 am
- Location: Dortmund
Re: Trigger of Walther LP400
I just got my new LP400 (cilynder date 10/2014, so I assume the gun is from the same date). I assume it comes with the "latest setup " springs!
Adjusting the trigger was a pain in the ass! The second stage was so heavy, so I removed the 2nd stage spring to check if it was the cause of the problem!
So I found out that the poroblem is the sear engagement! go get a lighter second stage, instead of the normal 1/4 to 1/2 anti-clockwise turn (like the procedure described on LP300 manuals and other APs), I had to adjust it for 1/12 of a turn ( yes, just a turn 30º )! I taped on the gun, on various positions to ensure the trigger was firing without pressing it!
The second stage screw is unscreed all the way, so I used a bit of locktite to to ensure it doesn't come out... I can always cut a bit of the spring!
Now, the trigger feels good for me! Very crisp, but also with light second stage!
My conslusion is that, regardless the springs (that you can adjust), the sear angle was conceived for a very crisp trigger! I guess with time it will polish a little and I will have to re-adjust it!
The factory trigger setting are ridiculous, very long and light 1st stage, a a brick wall on 2nd stage. No wonder why people complain so much ... (most of the shooter I now are afraid of deep tweaking their guns)!
Adjusting the trigger was a pain in the ass! The second stage was so heavy, so I removed the 2nd stage spring to check if it was the cause of the problem!
So I found out that the poroblem is the sear engagement! go get a lighter second stage, instead of the normal 1/4 to 1/2 anti-clockwise turn (like the procedure described on LP300 manuals and other APs), I had to adjust it for 1/12 of a turn ( yes, just a turn 30º )! I taped on the gun, on various positions to ensure the trigger was firing without pressing it!
The second stage screw is unscreed all the way, so I used a bit of locktite to to ensure it doesn't come out... I can always cut a bit of the spring!
Now, the trigger feels good for me! Very crisp, but also with light second stage!
My conslusion is that, regardless the springs (that you can adjust), the sear angle was conceived for a very crisp trigger! I guess with time it will polish a little and I will have to re-adjust it!
The factory trigger setting are ridiculous, very long and light 1st stage, a a brick wall on 2nd stage. No wonder why people complain so much ... (most of the shooter I now are afraid of deep tweaking their guns)!
Re: Trigger of Walther LP400
If you do a search you will find the trigger has been discussed a number of times.
The second stage was a balance between two springs (one adjustable). These opposing
springs set up a feel so that little or no trigger collapse was felt on sear release.
The problem with the original trigger was the inability to reduce the second stage weight
down to very low values.
Some coaches would say insane weights on second stage.
What happened was that the second stage spring was fairly stiff but with limited range, so
you reduced the spring contact to reduce weight and the spring would loose any contact
(ie no compression) this made the sear unreliable and total weight variable.
The update was to remove the paper clip spring and change the second stage spring.
This gave a lighter second stage weight but in my opinion it also changed the let off feel.
My solution was to keep the paper clip spring opposing the second stage spring to keep the feel
and to change the second stage spring to a lighter coil weight but with increased length.
This gave me a lighter second stage weight and increased the adjustment range to keep a
linear adjustment on the sear.
My trigger has a nice feel with a reliable 400/120g weight.
The second stage was a balance between two springs (one adjustable). These opposing
springs set up a feel so that little or no trigger collapse was felt on sear release.
The problem with the original trigger was the inability to reduce the second stage weight
down to very low values.
Some coaches would say insane weights on second stage.
What happened was that the second stage spring was fairly stiff but with limited range, so
you reduced the spring contact to reduce weight and the spring would loose any contact
(ie no compression) this made the sear unreliable and total weight variable.
The update was to remove the paper clip spring and change the second stage spring.
This gave a lighter second stage weight but in my opinion it also changed the let off feel.
My solution was to keep the paper clip spring opposing the second stage spring to keep the feel
and to change the second stage spring to a lighter coil weight but with increased length.
This gave me a lighter second stage weight and increased the adjustment range to keep a
linear adjustment on the sear.
My trigger has a nice feel with a reliable 400/120g weight.
Re: Trigger of Walther LP400
Mine is around 430+90!
It's insanely crispy!
It's insanely crispy!
Re: Trigger of Walther LP400
Mine is also very crisp now. Second stage weight is finely adjustable with whole turns of the screw I made from acetal, coupled with very light but long spring. Pictures aren't very clear but show what I've done. Also is a picture of rear sight elevation adjustment knob.
Re: Trigger of Walther LP400
I am amazed!
You guys should go and teach Walther engineer on how to design a trigger for their next pistol!
I would very much like to try a lp400 with your triggers!!!!
You guys should go and teach Walther engineer on how to design a trigger for their next pistol!
I would very much like to try a lp400 with your triggers!!!!
Re: Trigger of Walther LP400
jbshooter, is that an extra weight on the trigger guard!?!? I'm amazed with your "hot roded" LP400!