Fred's Red

[Spencer]

anybody have (or know where to find) the formula for Fred's Red?

while tidying up the garage I have come across a gallon of transmission fluid with Dexron, which started me recalling 'Fred's Red', but I cannot find my copy of the formula (from many years back)


Spencer

[Fred Mannis]

anybody have (or know where to find) the formula for Fred's Red?

Subject changed: freds red (Ed's Red?)

3
From: Paul Stoufflet - view profile
Date: Tues, Feb 4 2003 12:39 am
Email: Paul Stoufflet <pstouff...@netscape.net>
Groups: tx.guns
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I believe you mean "Ed's Red"

The following is off the internet:

BBS: AirPower BBS

Date: Sat, 01-10-98 (19:26) Number: 7969 Refer: 0

To: ALL

From: ED HARRIS

Subj: Ed's Red Revisited

Conf: FIREARMS (286) Read: No Status: Public

"Ed's Red" - - Revisited

By C.E., "Ed" Harris

Since I mixed my first "Ed's Red" (ER) bore cleaner five years ago,
hundreds of users have told me that they find it as effective as
commercial products. This cleaner has an action similar to military
rifle bore cleaner, such as Mil-C-372B. Itaner, such as Mil-C-372B. It
is highly effective for removing plastic fouling from shotgun bores,
caked carbon inn semi-automatic rifles or pistols, or leading in
revolvers. "ER" is not a "decoppering" solution for fast removal of
heavy jacket fouling, but because is more effective in removal of caked
carbon and primer residues than most other cleaners, so metal fouling is
reduced when "ER" is used.

I researched the subject rather thoroughly and determined there was no
technical reason why an effective firearm bore cleaner couldn't be mixed
using common hardware store ingredients. The resulting cleaner is safe,
effective, inexpensive, provides excellent corrosion protection and
adequate residual lubrication. Routine oiling after cleaning is
unnecessary except for storage exceeding 1 year, or in harsh
environments, such as salt air exposure.

The formula is adapted from Hatcher's "Frankford Arsenal Cleaner No.18,"
but substitutes equivalent modern materials. Hatcher's recipe called for
equal parts of acetone, turpentine, Pratts Astral Oil and sperm oil, and
(optionally) 200 grams of anhydrous lanolin per liter into the cleaner.

Some discussion of the ingredients in ER is helpful to understand the
properties of the cleaner and how it works. Pratts Astral Oil was
nothing more than acidg more than acid free, deodorized kerosene. Today
you would ask for "K1" kerosene of the typesold for use in indoor space
heaters.

An inexpensive, effective substitute for sperm oil is Dexron III
automatic transmission fluid. Prior to 1950 most ATF's were sperm oil
based. During WWII sperm oil was mostly unavailable, so highly refined,
dewaxed hydrofinished petroleum oils were developed, which had excellent
thermal stability. When antioxidants were added to prevent gumming these
worked well in precision instruments.

With the high demand for automatic transmission autos after WWII, sperm
oil was no longer practical to produce ATFs in the needed quantities
needed, so the wartime expedients were mass produced. ATFs have been
continually improved over the years. The additives contained in Dexron
include detergents or other surfactants which are highly suitable for
inclusion in an all-purpose cleaner, lubricant and preservative.

Hatcher's Frankford Arsenal No. 18 used gum spirits of turpentine, but
turpentine is both expensive and also highly flammable, so I chose not
to use it. Much safer and more inexpensive are "aliphatic mineral
spirits," which are an open-chain organic solvent, rather than the
closed-chain, benzene ring structure, commontructure, common to
"aromatics," such as naptha or "lighter fluid." Sometimes called "safety
solvent," aliphatic mineral spirits are used for thinning oil based
paint, as automotive parts cleaner and is commonly sold under the names
"odorless mineral spirits," "Stoddard Solvent" or "Varsol".

Acetone is included to provide an aggressive, fast-acting solvent for
caked smokeless powder residues. Because acetone readily evaporates and
the fumes are harmful in high concentrations, it is recommended that it
be left out if the cleaner will be used indoors, in soak tanks or in
enclosed spaces lacking forced air ventilation. Containers should be
kept tightly closed when not in use. ER is still effective without
acetone, but not as "fast-acting."

"Ed's Red" does not chemically dissolve copper fouling in rifle bores,
but it does a better job of removing carbon and primer residue than most
other cleaners. Many users have told me, that frequent and exclusive use
of "ER" reduces copper deposits, because it removes the old impacted
powder fouling left behind by other cleaners. This reduces the abrasion
and adhesion of jacket metal to the bore, leaving a cleaner surface
condition which reduces subsequent fouling. Experience indicatesrience
indicates that "ER" will actually remove metal fouling in bores if it is
left to "soak," for a few days so the surfactants will do the job, when
followed by a repeat cleaning. You simply have to be patient.

Addition of lanolin to ER is optional, because the cleaner works
perfectly well and gives adequate corrosion protection and lubrication
without it. Inclusion of lanolin makes the cleaner easier on the hands,
increases its lubricity and film strength and improves corrosion
protection if firearms, tools or equipment will be routinely exposed to
salt air, water spray, or corrosive urban atmospheres.

I recommend the lanolin included if you intend to use the cleaner as a
protectant for long term storage or for a "flush" after water cleaning
of black powder firearms or those fired with military chlorate primers.
This is because lanolin has a great affinity for water and readily
emulsifies so that the bore can be wiped of residual moisture, leaving a
protective film. If you inspect your guns and wipe them down twice
yearly, you can leave out the lanolin and save about $10 per gallon.

At current retail prices you can buy all the ingredients to mix ER,
without the lanolin for about $12 per gallon. I urge you to mix some
yourself. I ame yourself. I am confident it will work as well for you as
it does for me and hundreds of users who got the "recipe" on the Fidonet
Firearms Echo.

CONTENTS: Ed's Red Bore Cleaner

*

1 part Dexron ATF, GM Spec. D-20265 or later.

*

1 part Kerosene - deodorized, K1

*

1 part Aliphatic Mineral Spirits

*

CAS #64741-49-9, or substitute "Stoddard Solvent", CAS #8052-41-3, or
equivalent.

*

1 part Acetone, CAS #67-64-1.

*

(Optional 1 lb. of Lanolin, Anhydrous, USP per gallon, or OK to
substitute Lanolin, Modified, Topical Lubricant, from the drug store)

MIXING INSTRUCTIONS:

Mix outdoors, in good ventilation. Use a clean 1 gallon metal,
chemical-resistant, heavy gage PET or PVC plastic container. NFPA
approved plastic gasoline storage containers are OK. Do NOT use HDPE,
which is permeable, because the acetone will slowly evaporate. Acetone
in ER will attack HDPE over time, causing the container to collapse,
making a heck of a mess!

Add the ATF first. Use the empty container to measure the otherainer to
measure the other components, so that it is thoroughly rinsed. If you
incorporate the lanolin into the mixture, melt this carefully in a
double boiler, taking precautions against fire. Pour the melted lanolin
it into a larger container, rinsing the lanolin container with the bore
cleaner mix, and stirring until it is all dissolved. I recommend
diverting up to 4 ozs. per quart of the 50-50 ATF/kerosene mix to use as
"ER-compatible" gun oil. This can be done without impairing the
effectiveness of the remaining mix. Label and safety warnings follow:

FIREARM BORE CLEANER

CAUTION: FLAMMABLE MIXTURE -- HARMFUL IF SWALLOWED -- KEEP OUT OF REACH
OF CHILDREN

Contents: petroleum distillates, surfactants, organometallic
antioxidants and acetone.

1. Flammable mixture, keep away from heat, sparks or flame.

2. FIRST AID, If swallowed DO NOT induce vomiting, call physician
immediately. In case of eye contact immediately flush thoroughly with
water and call a physician. For skin contact wash thoroughly.

3. Use with adequate ventilation. Avoid breathing vapors or spray mist.
It is a violation of Federal law to use this product in a manner
inconsistent with itsonsistent with its labeling. Reports have
associated repeated and prolonged occupational overexposure to solvents
with permanent brain and nervous system damage. If using in closed
armory vaults lacking forced air ventilation wear respiratory protection
meeting NIOSH TC23C or equivalent. Keep container tightly closed when
not in use.

INSTRUCTIONS FOR USE:

1. Open the firearm action and ensure the bore is clear. Cleaning is
most effective when done while the barrel is still warm from firing.
Saturate a cotton patch with bore cleaner, wrap or impale on jag and
push it through the bore from breech to muzzle. The patch should be a
snug fit. Let the first patch fall off and do not pull it back into the
bore.

2. Wet a second patch, and similarly start it into the bore from the
breech, this time scrubbing from the throat area forward in 4-5" strokes
and gradually advancing until the patch emerges out the muzzle. Waiting
approximately 1 minute to let the bore cleaner soak will improve its
action.

3. For pitted, heavily carbon-fouled service rifles, leaded revolvers or
neglected bores a bronze brush wet with bore cleaner may be used to
remove stubborn deposits. This is unnecessary for smooth, target-grade
barrels in routine use.
routine use.

4. Use a final wet patch pushed straight through the bore to flush out
loosened residue dissolved by Ed's Red. Let the patch fall off the jag
without pulling it back into the bore. If you are finished firing,
leaving the bore wet will protect it from rust for 1 year under average
atmospheric conditions.

5. If lanolin is incorporated into the mixture, it will protect the
firearm from rust for up to two years, even in a humid environment. (For
longer storage use Lee Liquid Alox or Cosmolene). "ER" will readily
remove hardened Alox or Cosmolene.

6. Wipe spilled Ed's Red from exterior surfaces before storing the gun.
While Ed's Red is harmless to blue and nickel finishes, the acetone it
contains is harmful to most wood finishes.

7. Before firing again, push two dry patches through the bore and dry
the chamber, using a patch ...

[Guest 007]

http://www.flat5.net/eds_red.html
Ed has used the home-made cleaning solution known as "Ed's Red"
Primary Ingredients
Makes slightly more than one (1) gallon of Ed's Red.

1 qt. ATF III (Automatic Transmission Fluid), Walmart automotive department, about $2.00
1 qt. Acetone, Home Depot paint department, $5.69 plus tax. (Probably also available at Walmart.) This ingredient is listed as "optional" in the original formulation -- it accelerates the cleaning action -- and is the most volatile [and hazardous] ingredient.
1 qt. Deodorized Mineral Spirits, Home Depot paint department, $3.69 plus tax. (Probably also available at Walmart.)
1 qt. K1 Kerosene. This was the second-most difficult item to locate (in Phoenix AZ). None of the sporting goods stores I contacted (in Phoenix) carried it. A few had "Coleman Fuel" but, examining the can, I couldn't determine the ingredients. Using my favorite internet search engine, however, I found kerosene at a fuels distributor in Phoenix. I called and verified they would sell me as little as one gallon (in a gasoline container that I would provide). The kerosene was $3.20 (cash) for one gallon. Western States Petroleum, 450 S. 15th Ave, Phoenix AZ 85007, 602-252-4011.
1 lb. Lanolin.

[Spencer]

Always was poor on names...

Thanks muchly

Spencer

[Fortitudo Dei]

I've been using Ed's Red as my primary gun cleaner since I started shooting and have found it to be excellent. I've never had any call to add the lanolin though.
It's also a bit stinky so my wife insists that I only clean my guns outside (fair enough). I make it up and store it in a aluminium camping stove fuel bottle, then pour small amounts (perhaps 75 - 100 mls or so) into a small screw-top tin from which I use it to soak my patches. The only thing is that the acetone is very volatile so it will evaporate off in normal use long before any of the other ingredients (you can easily tell when this has happened when that classic acetone nail-polish-type smell disappears). As such I tend to throw out the contents of the small tin after about three months and get a fresh batch from my main bottle. You could just top it up with a bit of extra acetone, but the proportion would be a bit out and the low cost of Ed's Red hardly makes it worthwhile.